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Author Replies
02/01/06 06:34 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Have some of the other guys bring some bottles up.....

You don't have to be the ONLY pack mule.... ;-}

02/02/06 09:38 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Everything's a go. Got my stuff yesterday, yeast starter is rocking.

We have a local macro brew here in Tampa: Yuengling. Anybody want a Yuengling? :) Haven't tasted a Russian River brew yet - but man, you all on the West Coast are some lucky dogs.

Dark Candi
02/02/06 10:26 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
ok, my starter is ready, and so I will brew tomorrow. I think I will do somethiing like this:

70% Pils

10% Caramunich

20% dark syrup/ white sugar

a pinch of Coreander

styrian: bittering

hallertau/ styrian: flavor

Rochefort yeast from a bottle of 10

shooting for 1.096

IBU 27

I know that in "Brew Like A Monk", Stan Hieronymus lists the use of wheat starch, so I will try to use something like that. Maybe for 5%

What is wheat starch? Flour?

02/02/06 10:58 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Wheat starch

A starch derived from wheat. Also known as non-glutinous flour and wheaten cornflour, wheat starch is the by-product when gluten (derived from wheat protein) is made. Although a suitable substitute for cornflour when thickening, it really comes to the fore in the tender pouches of translucent, pleated dough that enclose tiny, tasty steamed morsels of Chinese dim sum. Don't be confused by the packaging: wheaten cornflour is not a feat of genetic engineering, but merely a misnomer. It is actually a fine wheat starch.

I've substituted flaked corn for wheat starch, but if you find some wheat starch and use it, let us know how it turns out.

Dark Candi
02/02/06 11:17 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Thanks N8!

I'll see if I can find some.

02/02/06 03:57 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap

Joe - Tampa, eh? Do you know that Krotchrot guy?? I just watched his brewing video last night..... Would have been better with some mind bending recreational medication... but cool anyway...

N8 - You lost me on that Wheat Starch thing... ;-}

Joe - Whatever you want to send is find, beer wise...

My Roch 10 has slowed and may be ready for the ol' secondary...

02/03/06 09:28 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I didn't realize he was from Tampa! Looks vaguely familiar - might have run into him at our LHBS(which sucks). He set up his own Homebrew Forum too.
02/03/06 10:34 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I think the point of wheat starch is to make the wort more fermentable without adding to the flavor. Many Belgian ales ferment very thouroughly, achieving impressive finishing gravities. I have heard the reason for this is to make the beer a better accompaniment with food. Wine is great with food, big taste but not filling, that's cause it attenuates very well. A beer of strength similar to a red wine would tend to have a higher finishing gravity which would fill you up faster thus detract from the meal.

I kinda thought that Chimay was the only Trappist to use starch though, Rochefort does too?

02/03/06 12:29 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Yea, Rochefort uses wheat starch. I had heard that before the Brew Like a Monk came out.

The recipe I've used for Roch. always has a bit of flaked corn to achieve the same type of attenuation that you mentioned the wheat starch does. I think next time I make it, i will use wheat starch, if I can find it. Not going to stress too much over it, since it does only add to the fermentation with no real flavor addition.

02/03/06 02:50 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I added the Corn Flakes to my recipe....we'll see what how it works.... shouldn't be any taste.....
02/03/06 02:52 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap

The HBS in Krotchrots video looked fairly empty.... Shelves with nothing on them......and the guy had to crank the mill by hand!!! Wow! That's primative....

02/03/06 03:48 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I haven't seen the video yet but what you're describing is the LHBS. It used to be awesome! Originally owned by the Dobles, it had everything. Now that the Dobles run/own the Tampa Bay Brewing Co. the store is just lame. I mail order everything now.
02/04/06 03:09 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Brew session completed. Came in at 1.094 - was shooting for 1.096. Oh well, not crying. I burnt my nose smelling some hot wort and it hurt like hell. Also added some homemade caramel syrup. The beer's fairly dark - hope I didn't blow the SRM. I was surprised by how much more sugar it took to bump Herman H.'s Roche 8 recipe up to a Roche 10. Oh, I'm going to attempt an open fermentation if I can muscle up the cajones. It's either going to turn out great or become balsamic vinegar. :)
02/13/06 02:33 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Update: Did an open primary ferment for 4 days, which after the krausen started sinking I put the lid on. I would caution anyone making Herman H.'s Roche clone to bump the gravity up with both grain and sugar(like it says in Brew Like A Monk). I used only extra sucrose and homemade caramel syrup and I think I'm around ~20% of the fermentables as sucrose. Took a hydrometer reading today 1.011, temperature corrected. Still fermenting - have a feeling it's going to dip below 1.010. Anyways, I asked my wife to taste the hydro sample and tell what kind of fruit it reminded her of. Figs. She said figs folks.:)
Sean Paxton
02/13/06 03:54 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Finally had some time to brew up the Rochefort 10 clone yesterday. The brew came out very nice. Used a pound of the Dark Candi Syrup for the Dubbel swap. Gave the brew a very nice red hue, over the dark brown maltiness. Lots of flavors going on, as well as a great body.

Recipe: Rochefort 10

Brewer: Sean Paxton

Style: Belgian Dark Strong Ale

TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications


Batch Size: 6.00 gal

Boil Size: 7.25 gal

Estimated OG: 1.095 SG

Estimated Color: 43.6 SRM

Estimated IBU: 28.5 IBU

Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 %

Boil Time: 90 Minutes



Amount Item Type %

or IBU

6.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) (1.6 SRM) Grain 36.9 %

3.00 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 18.5 %

1.50 lb Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 9.2 %

1.50 lb Caravienne Malt (22.0 SRM) Grain 9.2 %

1.00 lb Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 6.2 %

0.50 lb Aromatic Malt Grain 3.0%

0.25 lb Special B Malt (180.0 SRM) Grain 1.5 %

0.68 lb Date Sugar (3.0 SRM) (Mash) Sugar 6.2 %

1.00 tsp 5.2 (Mash) Misc

1.00 lb Candi Sugar, Clear (0.5 SRM) (Boil) Sugar 6.2 %

1.00 lb Dark Rock Candi Syrup (500.0 SRM) (10) Sugar 6.2 %

1.00 lb Turbinado Sugar (Boil) Sugar 6.2%

1.00 oz Kent Goldings [5.90%] (60 min) Hops 15.1 IBU

1.50 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker [2.90%] (60 min) Hops 10.7 IBU

0.50 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker [2.90%] (30 min) Hops 2.7 IBU

1.00 tsp Servomyces (Boil 10.0 min) Misc

1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 min) Misc

5.00 gm Coriander Seed (Boil 5.0 min) Misc

1 Pkgs Belgian Abbey II (Wyeast Labs #1762) Starter 2500ml

Decoction Mash:

135 Degrees for 30 minutes

145 Degrees for 30 minutes

160 Degrees for 30 minutes

170 Degrees for 10 minutes

O.G.: 1.106



02/17/06 03:01 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Looking forward to trying all these Roch 10's!!!

Figs!!! Yea!!

I need to check my Roch 10 this weekend.... I'll let everybody know what it's tasting like.....

Ryan Artuso
03/21/06 08:00 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Is this swap closed? I have a Trappist in secondary right now, it needs about 6 more weeks before bottling. It was not really meant to be a Rochefort clone. I used WLP500(Chimay) for the brew.

OG 1.100

Fg 1.010

03/23/06 03:43 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap



06/14/06 07:57 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I'm a little scared to bring this up - but who's ready to swap? I'd just like to say that mine pretty much sucks, very alcoholic, very strong, very plain Jane. But I'm still willing for a swappage since I said I would and I don't mind drinking other people's beer.
Ryan A
06/15/06 12:56 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
I have a 12.2% with the Chimay yeast and a 10.2% with the Westmalle yeast. One of them is tasting pretty good, one of them is hot (much like I find young Roch 10 to be). I don't recall which one was hot (I think the Westmalle). I will check tomorrow since I have already drank too much tonight for that little tasting (mmmm Cuvee Rene....)
Ryan A
06/15/06 10:59 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Both are tasting ok. The Chimay is a bit hot. The one with the Westmalle yeast is a bit better, not a bad Westy clone. Though, both could use more time.
06/17/06 07:48 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Hey, what kinds of finishing gravities did you guys get (caught yours Ryan)?
Dark Candi
06/17/06 10:35 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Well I am in this so I have one...

I am working on the % of syrup so, I pushed to the outer limit and used 40% syrup.

Everything about the recipe is from the Holtrop formula, except that each week I brew it and increase the syrup.

I am using the 1762.

The final gravity is something around 1.010 from 1.094

It has that Rochefort profile, but to intense. As expected.

Happy to send if anyone is interested.

06/20/06 07:50 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Mine came in at 1.010 from an OG of 1.094. I think I fermented this beer too low - started in the really low 60's and brought her up from there. The beer just didn't develop like I thought it would. Sent some to N8 - said it was okay but that it lacked Belgian character(sound the deathknell) but I completely agree. Anyone who wants to switch a roo:

jfleisch at tampabay dot rr dot com

Hey - put something in the subject line(please).

Sean Paxton
06/22/06 01:13 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Hey All,

My Rochefort 10 clone is doing well. I bottled it about a month ago, OG was 1.106 and my FG was 1.022. I am pleased. With aging, I can see the Belgian stang coming through. The malt is pretty close and is the body, just a tad sweeter than I wanted. In another month or so, Id be ready to swap

Brian, 40% is insane, but Id be up for trying it. I used a lot in my Rochefort 10, but not that much. I was talking to Stan H. about sugar and he mentioned a different sugar that Rochefort uses, different than what the Dark Candi Sugar Syrup is. Could you also give us more info on the other sugars and who is using them?



Dark Candi
06/23/06 12:34 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Hey Sean,

I am importing the soft candi sugar that Stan is referring to. Here is a link:


Also, here is a link to an interview with Stan where he talks about this sugar and Rochefort:


Sean, I will be happy to send you some of this soft candi sugar if you would like to try it. Just let me know.

Also, I have 6 of the 40% beers left. I think it will surprise you and it is a great learning tool. Just let me know who wants one and where to ship.


Sean Paxton
06/23/06 02:42 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Thanks Brian,

I'll take you up on your offer of sugar and a beer with the 40%. Would be interesting to see the flavor profile, specially afer the the Dark Candi Syrup swap.

You have the blonde sugar too correct? Which breweries are using that?



Dark Candi
06/24/06 02:02 PM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Sean, I will send it out on monday. Please send an e-mail with the amount you need for a test.

Also, how many people are in this swap? As I said, I only have 6 of the 40% left, and I want to make sure Steve gets one. So I guess thats 5. I can ship to everyone on monday. Please let me know.

As to the Blond, yes I stock that as well.

What breweries are using it? I am not the one to ask. I decided to import a pallet or two of these sugars before I knew anything about who used them. It was about a week before they arrived that I learned from Stan about Rochefort. I posted a link to his interview.

I have used both a few times, but I think it is best that anyone who is interested try them and see what they think.


10/13/06 01:45 AM  
Re: HB'd Rochefort 10 Swap
Sorry guys.... It's been a busy summer...

As some of you may have heard, my Rochefort had an accident... Hope you guys continue with the swap...

I'll be moving onto a Flemish Red which should age for awhile... I found some nice heavy toasted oak for the secondary...

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