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Chris V.
05/10/06 11:50 AM  
Saison with American Hops
Hey guys,

Anyone here do any experimenting with American hops in a Saison? I was thinking about using some Columbus for bittering with Cascade for aroma. I would stick to about 25-30 IBU's. I have made about three Saisons always using the WLP 565 yeast. I am thinking that the citrus notes from the Cascades will interact nicely with the spice flavors that 565 kicks out.

Any opinions????

SebastianP
05/10/06 01:05 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
I have been known to do this from time to time. A couple of key points, keep the actual bitterness low, otherwise it gets in the way of the spicy yeast contribution. I say this having assumed you would like a solid hop flavor in your beer. The combination of bitterness and hop flavor is too much for the yeast character and can clash a bit. Higher bitterness with with less hop flavor (Think Saison Dupont), or lots of hop flavor with a lower bitterness (a chance to showcase the American Hops) will both work well with the spiciness from the Saison yeast.

I would not go higher than 22 IBUs or so. At this level of bitterness you can pretty much not add any bittering hops. Do your first addition of hops with about 15 minutes left in the boil, and just keep on dumping them in until flame-out.

I have used Amarillo, and Santiam successfully in a Saison, and I think that Cascade would work quite well.

So based on your specs I would say skip the Columbus entirely, and add enough Cascade late in the boil to get you up to a bitterness between 16 & 22.

Chris V.
05/10/06 01:38 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
SebastianP,

Thanks for the thoughts. Yes, I would like to showcase the hops a bit to see how they taste compared to the pepper notes and phenolics that the 565 yeast throws. Something similar to when when cooks put top spiced meats with lightly cooked or seared fruits.

Loren
05/11/06 12:10 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
I think Simcoe, Palisades, Sterling, Amarillo and yes even Cascades would work perfectly as flavor only hops in a Saison. I'm trying to convince a local brewpub to brew one this way.
Sean Paxton
05/11/06 12:27 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
I'd have to agree with Loren. Summit would be too bitter, and at 18.5% Alpha really hard to control the over-bittering effects... Same goes for Columbus or Warrior (not a lot of flavor either)...

Which brewery are you refering to Loren?

Did anyone have the Saison from Southampton Brewery: Cuvee des Fluers? Anyone know what flowers where used? Really enjoyed this beer. Wishing I was close to it or could find it locally...

Cheers,

Sean

Loren
05/11/06 12:33 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
Cuvee des Fleurs may not come out this year. Not sure. It was released last year and the year prior.

Flowers used were:

Mums, roses, marigolds and lavender?

"Southampton Cuvee des Fleurs is a special Saison-style brew lightly flavored with a blend of edible flowers including L. augustifolia, A. nobilis, C. officinalis, R. canina and of course, H. lupulus."

City Steam is the brewpub I'm prodding.

Chris V.
05/11/06 05:27 PM  
Re: Saison with American Hops
I do like Simcoe. Not a bad hop at all. I would like to stick with Cascade because I have some on hand and I know them well. I have some Amarillo, but I am saving them for an APA.

Thanks for the opinions Loren.

 
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