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Ryan Artuso
06/16/06 11:15 AM  
Help!
I brewed this 2 days ago:

American Sour Wheat

17# B. Pils

4# Malted White Wheat

3# Flaked Wheat

Single infusion @ 154-152 for one hour in a fairly thin mash. Sparged at 190 like a crazy monkey. Must have collected about 17 gallons of wort. Aged hops at 3.5oz/5 gallon for 2 hours. Final volume post boil was about 10 gallons. OG 1.058

5 gallons was aerated and I pitched a big starter of WLP510 (Orval Primary) as well as the dregs of a bottle of Cuvee Rene and JP Bam Biere.

2.5 gallons was aerated and racked onto a Brettanomyces Brux slurry, no other yeast was pitched.

2.5 gallons was not aerated and inoculated with Wyeast Lacto Delbrueckii. It is currently in a bath tub with 100 degree water. Some of this will be used to sour other brews.

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Today I checked on the fermentors and, I have a big problem with the Lactobacillus. I just took a peek and there was no smell other than that of fresh wort and no visible sign of activity. So I took a gravity reading, no change since I had pitched. It has been 36 hours since I pitched, the last 24 of which Iíve been holding the fermenter at 90-100 degrees. I pitched one of the big Wyeast packs that is supposed to be a pitchable amount for 5 gallons. Does anyone have any experience pitching only Lacto?

Al B
06/16/06 12:16 PM  
Re: Help!
3.5 oz of hops may have a negative impact on Lactobacilli (L. delbrueckii in particular). Age and temperature shock could also increase lag time in growth (i.e. refrigeration to 100F is a big jump).

Al B
06/16/06 12:29 PM  
Re: Help!
Ryan -

Even though bacilli can grow at 100F, its probably not the optimum temp. for delbrueckii. You could try the following options:

1. add a fresh culture with some yeast nutrients and lower the temp a bit to 80-90. Although not critical, they work just fine at lower temps.

2. add a starter of recultured lactobacilli that are more resistant to hops (dregs of certain bottles - I have good success w/ Petrus Oud bruin). Well, that might take awhile.

3. add some Pediococcus (although this might create higher amounts of acid + diacetyl).

Ryan
06/16/06 01:07 PM  
Re: Help!
It was actually a slow ramp up to 100 degrees (more like 95) from fridge temp. I left it on the counter for 6 hours at 70 before pitching it into 75 degree wort, then held it there for 12 hours before putting it in an 85 degree water bath. I then raised the temp of the water to 100. The water has been kept in the range of 85-95 since then.

I talked to one of the lab guys at Wyeast. He said that it can be very slow even with a large cell count. He suggested 85 degrees and that I pitch a neutral ale yeast to scrub all the oxygen and give it some CO2. He also said that I should be checking the pH and not the gravity to see if it is going.

I just pitched US-56. I need to get some pH test strips that go below 4.6

I want to avoid adding any other bugs to this because some of it is going to be used to sour my next batch of Beliner Weiss.

Ryan
06/16/06 01:09 PM  
Re: Help!
Berliner Weisse
Al B
06/16/06 01:20 PM  
Re: Help!
Yeah, I was going to mention pH readings.

I haven't had any problem growing Lactobacilli including delbreuckii in the presence of some oxygen. In truth, many lactobacilli are "microaerophilic" meaning they can grow lightly in O2. I can grow them just fine on agar plates.

You'll probably see some sourness in 1-2 weeks, don't worry. If not, I can recommend some sources to find hop-resistant strains.

 
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