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Author Replies
Brian Richards
07/05/06 08:26 PM  
Piraat Ale Clone
Hi, I am fairly new on this site but I'm loving it so far. I'm sure somebody here could help me find a good clone recipe for Piraat Ale. I used to be able to buy it in my town but it has disappeared so I wanted to brew something as close to it as possible.
SteveG
07/06/06 09:39 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
I understand one can be found in a book by Tess and Mark Szamatulski called "Clone Brews". Cloning beers has never been my thing, I always saw that as being kind of like a trained painter in oils copying the old masters instead of creating his own works. But if I was going to attempt a cloning I'd think the fun would be the process of backwards engineering the original. I think if you do that you walk away not only with a few gallons of beer but also enhanced understanding.

So let me ask you, how would you describe the differences between Piraat and, say, Duvel? I'm not much on math but I would imagine if you knew terminal gravity and ABV there must be a reasonably simple equasion to determine starting gravity.

Brian Richards
07/06/06 11:26 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
It has been so long since I had a Duvel. I think Duvel would be more of a Golden beer with lighter residual sweetness as oppose to the Piraat Ale. I can't remember the ABV on Duvel either. I guess reverse engineering would be one way to go. With a new baby in the house I have to plan my brew sessions way in advance and they are usually far and few in between so trial an error could take me forever. I guess I am not looking to clone a Piraat Ale as much as just brewing a beer to that style.
SteveG
07/06/06 11:53 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Oh hey - in retrospect I think Piraat has changed considerably in the last 10 years. I havn't had one in nearly that long, back in the day it was a very strong golden ale. But now that I think about it Piraat was on tap at Eulogy (philly) when I was there last Thanksgiving and I think it was a darker brew. I seem to recall being surprised about that. Does that sound right? I stopped drinking it in the late 90s cause I had a few consecutive bottles with significant floaters. It was very effervescent, as I recall just popping the cap blew its signficant sediment into the beer. It was kinda like pulp in OJ, but the bits had a gross soft feel. Same was true of its sister beer at the time, GoudenDraak.

Can anyone liken Piraat to another beer?

Anyway, you are right that trying to nail a beer via reverse engineering can take a bunch of trys. The truth is the same can be said about going from a recipe, it takes a lot more than that to really nail a beer. The hope is that the inevitable "failures" along the way are only so cause they missed the target, not because they did not turn out to be fun to drink. BTW, I'm pretty sure Duvels abv is 8.7. I think that would have made it a reasonable starting point to understand Piraat 10 years ago, but that is probably not the case today. Sorry for the bum steer!

N8
07/06/06 12:21 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
If it's any consulation, Duvel starts at 1.069 drops to around 1.006 to a ABV of ~8.5% It's pils malt 17% sucrose. The hops are Styrian Goldings and Saaz, to a level of about 30IBUs.

As far as I remember Piraat is similar, a Belgian Strong golden. But I haven't had one in years either, for pretty much the same reasons as Steve.

Dsanborn
07/06/06 01:42 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Piraat is back in this area after a bit of an absence. Everybody went crazy because of the ABV (10ish?) not realizing there are better high abv brews out there.

I had some and it was significantly sweeter than Duvel (by my tastebuds)- but that could be due to the slightly higher abv - and it was really not worth what the place was selling it for.

Way back when - Piraat was the first strong golden I ever had (it was more readily avail than Duvel) and to sound cliche "it was an eye openner." I still love the style enough to have never tried to homebrew it.

cheers, scamborn

Brian Richards
07/06/06 07:50 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
I've heard Piraat described and have seen it listed as a triple amber a few times. Has anyone else seen this?
brewbetterbeer
07/20/06 05:30 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
I like both beers very much but for different

reasons:

Duvel: highly attenuated and carbonated ,has a mild pear flavor , quite a style on it's own

Piraat: sweeter than Duvel and has a distinct coriander aroma and flavor , very much like a traditional wit beer.

My 2 cents

keep cloning and brewing!!!!

JoeFleischman
07/20/06 07:32 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Guess who's trying to culture up some Piraat yeast? Me. Man, I like this better than Duvel. I think the yeast is key since this beer is undoubtedly mostly Pils and sugar with some minor other stuff that N8 could probably cipher. I'd start first by reculturing the yeast dregs from a bottle...
Sinkas
05/07/07 02:42 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Anyone end up making a decent clone, thsi is my fav and woudl love to make a decent clone
Scott Jackson
05/08/07 01:22 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Although I have not brewed it, this recipe looks close to what I think Piraat tastes like. I assume it is for 5 gallons.

14 lbs. Belgian Pils

.25 lbs. Acidulated Malt

1 lbs. Midwest Wheat Malt

1.5 lbs. Honey

.75 lbs. Corn Flaked

.5 oz. Cascade (Whole, 5.50 %AA) boiled 0 min.

2 oz. Liberty (Whole, 4.1 %AA) boiled 90 min.

1 oz. Cascade (Whole, 5.50 %AA) boiled 15 min.

1/2 ounces Corriander, ground

1 ounces Sweet Orange zest, fresh

Yeast : WYeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity info

Sinkas
05/09/07 08:44 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
HI therer,

So you think it had american hops?

I actually had a bottle last night, and it seemed to really lacked the huge malt backbone I recall enjoying..

The Boucanier beers by the same guys have the maltiness I am after still.

The WeekEnd Brewer
05/14/07 06:43 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
This is a very close recipe. I dont't know your brewing style, so if you need it converted to extract, just let me know. All/Grain 5 gal.

17 Lb's Belgian Pilsner malt, 1/2 lb. crystal 20 L., 4 oz. Cara-Vienna, 4 oz. Aromatic. 1 Lb. Belgian light candi sugar, 1 oz. Brewers Gold @ 5 AAU (60 min), 1 oz. Styrian Golding with 1/2 tsp.Crushed Coriander(15 min.) 1/2 oz. Styrian Golding with 1/2 tsp.Crushed Coriander @ 1 tsp Sweet orange peel (10 min), White Labs WLP500 Trappist Yeast, Prime with 1-1/4 Cup wheat DME.

Best mashed @ 152 Degrees for appoxx. 90 min. Depending on your efficiency you should have a 10/10-1/2 Alcolhol.

Also; Never-Ever, Use Cascade Hops on Any Beer From Belgian

Good Brewing

Sinkas
05/15/07 09:31 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Thanks for that Weekend brewer,

I was given a bottle of the american market 9% version this week, it will be interesting to see if its similar to the 10.5% beauty.

Scott Jackson
05/16/07 04:00 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
"Also; Never-Ever, Use Cascade Hops on Any Beer From Belgian"

For instance when trying to duplicate Houblon Chouffe IPA or Urthel Hop-it?

I agree that Cascade hops may not belong in a Piraat clone but that statement is pretty broad and not in the nature of the creative style of Belgian beers.

I have used Amarillo hops in a Saison that turned out great (Peter Bouchart said so) and I think Cascade hops would do well in a Saison as well.

Brian Richards
12/06/07 01:53 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
I have to agree with Scott on this one. Funny how this post resurfaced after a year and a half. I guess I can update this and say that I nailed a recipe about a year ago that came out awesome. Some friends and I drank it side by side to Piraat and we all preferred mine. Thats a good feeling. Almost as good a feeling as drinking that quad that Scott sent me last year for the trappist clone swap. Good lord that was an amazing beer.
Surfbrewer
12/23/07 01:06 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Brian, would you mind sharing the recipe that you made? I have been looking for a Piraat recipe. Thanks.

Cheers

sinkas
07/21/08 11:34 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Just bumping this,

Brian, could you share your recipe?

Sinkas

sinkas
07/21/08 11:37 PM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Just bumping this,

Brian, could you share your recipe?

Sinkas

B-Dub
09/01/08 01:20 AM  
Re: Piraat Ale Clone
Brian, love to see what you came up with.

B-Dub

 
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