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Like the BBB, the homeBBBrew board is not a club, just a place to talk about making beer. Is there a swap you would like to see happen? If we can find a few others who have something similar then lets do it!

I just really like the work levifunk is doing!

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Author Replies
10/31/07 03:38 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Ted, oh no! Can't have that, without you doing the right sugar the experiment looses something. Mine showed up today, Brian sent me a pound of moist blonde. I'll send mine to you. I don't need it for the swap (I'm dark syrup).
10/31/07 04:26 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Recieved sugar this afternoon.

1.5 lb each of Amber Liquid and Dark liquid. I'm set to do Amber, let me know if anyone needs the dark for the swap.

- Andy

10/31/07 04:46 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Okay guys, I just received one bottle of the dark liquid syrup and one package of the moist brown.
11/02/07 08:44 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
So has the final recipe been decided? If so, I'm ordering my stuff this weekend.
11/02/07 03:12 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Here is another hack. It's in percents and IBU's, everyone can account for there own efficencis.

- What do you suggest for mash temp and how long for dry-hops?

BBB Sugar Swap - Bitter

A ProMash Brewing Session - Recipe Details Report

Recipe Specifics


Batch Size (Gal):

Total Grain (Lbs):

Anticipated OG: 1.054 Plato: 13.29

Anticipated SRM: 12.4

Anticipated IBU: 42.8

Brewhouse Efficiency: 60 %

Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Formulas Used


Brewhouse Efficiency and Predicted Gravity based on Method #1, Potential Used.

Final Gravity Calculation Based on Points.

Hard Value of Sucrose applied. Value for recipe: 46.2100 ppppg

Yield Type used in Gravity Prediction: Fine Grind Dry Basis.

Color Formula Used: Morey

Hop IBU Formula Used: Rager

Additional Utilization Used For Plug Hops: 2 %

Additional Utilization Used For Pellet Hops: 10 %


% Name Origin Potential SRM


80.0 Pale Malt(2-row) Great Britain 1.038 3

13.3 Amber Liquid Sugar 1.030 40

3.3 Crystal 55L Great Britian 1.034 55

3.3 Wheat Malt America 1.038 2

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time


Goldings - E.K. Pellet 5.00 18.3 60 min.

Wye Challenger Pellet 7.50 19.2 60 min.

Goldings - E.K. Pellet 5.00 3.0 5 min.

Wye Challenger Pellet 7.50 2.3 5 min.

Dry-hop: .5 oz EK Goldings



WYeast 1318 London Ale III

11/02/07 05:57 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
I'd dry hop for one week and mash at 153-154*F.
11/03/07 09:43 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Thanks Ross,

Guys - To get everyone's buyin, please review the last cut at the recipe and provide feedback so we can finalize.


11/03/07 10:53 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Looks ok to me. I have blond sugar on the way. Won't brew this weekend, probably next.

11/04/07 10:37 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Fine by me. I'll brew sometime in the next week or two.
11/04/07 11:29 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Coolio! I'll be brewing around the same time.

11/04/07 01:37 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
I'll probably brew the weekend of the 17th.
11/06/07 12:27 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Were yall dry-hopping in primary or secondary? Is one week sufficent?

11/06/07 09:25 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Though I've not used this yeast before, my hope is that fermentation will be complete within 7 - 10 days. I'd like to leave it in the primary for 14 days and dry hop for the last week in the primary. I don't usually secondary a brew.
11/07/07 10:00 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
I'll go 7-10 days in primary (10-20 sec/bubble) and rack to secondary, then dry hop for a week or two depending on taste. Keg/bottle.

Won't brew this weekend, judging at Hops/Bops on Sat and wife's family thing on Sun.

11/09/07 10:59 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Received all of my ingredients yesterday and will probably brew next Saturday.
11/12/07 08:57 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Have to move up my schedule and will be brewing on 11/12. I will add my sugar (amber liquid) at 30min left in boil.

remember the vets and all who serve now.


11/12/07 09:48 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Guys, when we do the swap send me two of your beers. I will send all four to Brian so he can join us for the tasting or do his own tasting.

11/15/07 05:00 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Got the last of my ingredients... Keystone had White Labs 02 handy and no WY1318, so I'm using that sub. I should be able to brew this weekend.
11/24/07 02:15 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Status: Day 13 in primary

- 3.5 gal batch, pitched WY1318 at 72F OG 1.049 (missed SG of 1.054), amber liquid added at 20 min left in boil

- 12hrs temp dropped to 66F, 48hrs couple pops per min.

- at 4-5 days vigorous ferment 1/2in-1in krus., temp across 4-5days rise 66-71F, most active at 70F

- ferment actv done at 6days

- from day 6 to present, surface 3/4 clear, 1/4 surface angular chunks cosistency of saltine crackers, presence persistent

- Temp from day 6 to present 67-68F, at day 13 FG 1.017, heavy sulfur smell when popped carboy, sample taste of alcohol, fruity, little to no malt character, hazy appearance.

Overall first impression - not happy with lack of malt presence, even though fist time brewing this style with this yeast, I do remember using malt!!!

1) what are your experiences with this yeast: normal terminal gravity and temp would fusels kick in.

2) Does stuff left on surface ever settle and if not when is it ok to dry hop.

11/25/07 04:09 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

I brewed 5 days ago and hit 1053, moist blonde in at 15 minutes to go. Pitched at 66F but put heater on to bump up to 68F. Airlock going next morning and building up to 1-1/2 inch krausen that night. Didn't get to multiple burbs per second as with most ale yeast but steady rate at about one per second. Krausen did seem to start to drop lower after 2 days but rebounded back and thickened up. Day 5 still about 68F, 1-1/2 inch thick and 4 second airlock. Some fruit from airlock, no sulphur.

The surface chucks may be chucks of trub that co2 bubbles are sticking to and floated up. If you are not doing a secondary I would start the dry hopping now so that you are done within another week. With FG at 1.017, I would maintain temp at 68F and hope to drop a couple of points. If TG was down to 1.013-14 I would cool to 50F and that would help the beer clear. When the dry hops sink they may drag down the surface chucks.

First time I used 1318, but 1.049 to 1.017 is only about 65% attenuation. This yeast should do in the low 70's, 1.014-1.012.

12/03/07 01:04 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Well guys, after a two week delay (wife, baby and I were all sick with a cold) I finally got it done on Sunday.

1.054 gravity, added liquid sugar at 18 minutes left in the boil, brew is a dark orangey/copper color, pitched yeast at 63*F and fermenting at 69-70. Lag time of 10 hours, lots of convection about 18 hours after pitching with a one inch krausen head. Very steady burp,burp,burp,burp about every second. Esters from airlock but no sulphur yet.

12/03/07 02:34 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
I got it done last Friday.

2.5 gallon batch, 90 min boil, moist dark sugar added at flame out. Yeast going strong still. Once the krausen drops, in go the dry hops.

12/06/07 04:37 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Howdy all,

I plan on bottling this Saturday. 2 vol CO2

Where is everyone in the process?


12/09/07 09:51 AM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
My brew has been in the primary for one week now-

Nice, active fermentation that formed a four inch head about 26 hours after pitching.

After one week, alot of activity still present with lots of foam on top.

I'll probably dry hop today or tomorrow and hopefully bottle next Sunday.

12/09/07 06:43 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Need Group's Response ASAP

Tasted the FG sample (1.015) and to be technical - it blows!!!

Tastes like watery Tang - no body - and I don't think its a matter of lowering few gravity pts (@ 1.015 with no change for week) or carbonation. I'm not the most experienced with this style but I know this does not represent it and I won't present it.

I need a time check. When are we planning to swap? I'm thinking of doing a whole new 3 gal batch - only used 1/2 the amber sugar - and that would take at least 3-4 weeks putting it into mid January. I would thicken the mash to 1.3qts/lb grain, add 15% more base to boost efficiency, and tighten down on ferment control.

If not workable for the group, then I'm sorry, but I will have to drop out. It's been all good so whatever the group decides is fine

Thanks all

12/09/07 06:52 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter

Sorry to hear it didn't turn out so well. I was suspecting there may be a problem with the way you described the fermentation performance.

Considering if the rest of groups brew turn out similarly to yours then we obviously have a recipe problem and we may all need to re-brew a new recipe.

However, if we find that the rest of the brews turn out okay, I'm all for you brewing it again and waiting an extra month or so to try 'em out.

12/09/07 07:06 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Also, if we do decide to reformulate, I suggest we brew according to the Bitter guidelines in Designing Great Beers.
12/10/07 12:23 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
Thanks for the quick response Ross.

So I'm clear, its not the recipe but *MY* execution of the recipe that is problematic and the batch *I* brewed is not to the style.


12/10/07 12:26 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter
I just had a taste of mine from the fermenter, and it's definitely not watery tang... It's quite bitter and yet still a bit too sweet, even after 10 days on the yeast... maybe it's time to stir up the fermenter a bit to resuspend the yeasties.

Since I did a half-brew, I could certainly go along with a reformulation too... I've still got .4 lb of dark moist sugar left.

12/11/07 01:10 PM  
Re: Sugar Swap Bitter


How is your batch coming along?

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