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Adrian
02/25/11 04:21 PM  
Revisiting T-58 Yeast
I want to like this yeast. Really, I do. The price is right and the description from Fermentis sounds great. I hear De Struise uses this as their house yeast.

The last time I used it was a couple years back when I first got into brewing. I decided to get it a go again and uses it in 4 different batches: light ale, dark ale, wild ale, and cider

The first is like a mini tripel. Grist was the following:

38.2% Dingemans Pale Ale malt

38.2% Briess Base Malt (2-row)

5.9% Dingemans Aromatic Malt

5.9% Briess Red Wheat Malt

11.8% Clover Honey

SG at 1048, Vanguard hops at 60 and 30 minutes (21 IBU total) and fermented with Fermentis T-58 dry yeast. Rack to bright keg on day 10 (SG at 1009) and let condition for 8 days before racking to a serving keg and carbonating to about 3.2 volumes of CO2.

First off, this yeast takes forever and a day to drop out. Even cold conditioning it wouldnt help speed things out. This first batch took almost 2 weeks of cold conditioning in the serving keg to finally pour clear.

Secondly, the taste. First off, this is not the yeast one uses for a quick turnaround. For example, WLP023 tastes great while its still fermenting. This stuff tastes pretty harsh at first, and then slowly mellows out as the beer drops bright. Presently, at about 3 weeks since racking to the first keg the beer is starting to taste a little better. Lots of clove, some Belgian yeast fruity flavors (banana flavored bubblegum?), and a slightly tart finish. I also got a sort of cornbread grainy flavor early on. I now suspect it was due to the wheat. I also tasted some spiciness that took the form of sort of an alcohol bite. Odd for a low gravity cold fermented beer.

Overall, Id rate it, meh. Will it get better with time? Well see. Right now the taste is just unrefined. Its like mixing Belgian Trappist yeast with German Hefeweizen yeast. Just kind of weird.

Temperature profile was:

Day 1: 59 deg

Day 2: 60 deg

Day 3: 60 deg

Day 4: 64 deg

Day 5: 68 deg

Day 6: 71 deg (SG at 1014)

Day 7: -

Day 8: 68 deg

Day 9: -

Day 10: - (turn off heater)

Day 11: 60 deg (SG at 1009, rack to keg)

Any thoughts? Has anyone had success with T-58? The bucket sample of the wild ale (T-58 + A15 starter + pasteurized lactic acid) tasted pretty good early on. Tasted like lemonade in fact.

Ive got the dark ale sitting in the serving keg right now. Once that carbonates Ill report back with the findings. For comparison that was made using the following grist:

31.3% Dingemans Pale Ale malt

31.3% Briess Vienna Malt

3.1% Fawcett Dark Crystal I Malt

3.1% Dingemans Aromatic malt

18.8% Oat Flakes

12.5% Caramelized honey

SG 1046. Temp wasnt controlled:

Day 1: 64 deg

Day 2: 63 deg

Day 3: 60 deg

Day 4: 57 deg

Day 5: 60 deg

Day 6: 55 deg

Day 7: -

Day 8: 62 deg (SG 1008)

Day 9: - (rack to keg w/ 1oz blackstrap molasses for extra color)

Day 22: - Move to fridge (yeast laden sample SG 1006. taste like autolyzed yeast)

Day 23: 45 deg (keg transfer)

For the cider, I placed the bucket in my serving freezer which was set at 55 degrees. It hit about 72% apparent attenuation in 6 days despite being held at 55 degrees. I moved it into the warmest part of the house to finish out (probably 5 degrees warmer). It was still very cloudy at that time but I should be racking it to a keg shortly.

I decided to play around a little as well. So I took 1 gal of the 6 gal batch of cider and added 1lb of honey to it. I put the 1 gal back in the 55 degree freezer to ferment.

I also took the wild ale and put 1 gallon of it with 22 oz bottle of sour cherry syrup. Both experiments should hit about 10-11% ABV. Well see what happens.

jaymo
02/25/11 06:57 PM  
Re: Revisiting T-58 Yeast
You mentioned a slow turnaround due to mellowing over time. This also seems to be the case with the S-04 dry yeast.

I tried T-58 for the first time a bit over a month ago with a dark, high-gravity brew inspired by one of Mike T's dark saisons. I'd intended to go with 3711, but since the LBHS didn't have any fresh I went with T-58. It's not the smoothest character right now, but seems to be mellowing. I also tossed in some 3F, Oerbier, and JP Bam dregs into the mix. That should add enough sourness/wild complexity to smooth over the rough edges anyway!

Here's the recipe:

http://noaccountingfor.blogspot.com/2011/01/dark-strong-funky-belgian-ale-with.html

Now that you brought this up, I'll have to try a "clean" brew using this yeast w/out bugs once I get through my current "to-brew" list! I'm curious to hear how your cider turns out.

Adrian
02/25/11 08:23 PM  
Re: Revisiting T-58 Yeast
Cider SG at 1000. Still quite cloudy but the taste is okay and mouthfeel is surprisingly good for the SG. Tart with a decent apple character for such a young cider (I find the apple character increased with age). I'll keg it and report back after it's clear and carbonated.

No yeast qualities. No clove, no banana,etc. My guess is the yeast derived flavors are due to an interaction with the maltose and other stuff present in malt that's not found in fructose.

brewinhard
02/26/11 10:42 AM  
Re: Revisiting T-58 Yeast
I have had great success using the T-58 for strong tripels I have used. I have even taken 3rd BOS with this recipe and yeast combo. I did have to monitor the ferment temps closely and gave the beer 2 full mos of lagering at 40 deg before bottling up with fresh champagne yeast for insurance. I got a lot of tropical fruits and spice when I used at after allowing for the lagering to smooth things over a bit.
Adrian
03/10/11 02:43 PM  
Re: Revisiting T-58 Yeast
The beer got better. I think you are right that aging is critical with this strain. As of last week (3 weeks post fermentation) this batch is actually starting to taste good. I'd say it's turning out to be one of my better batches, oddly enough.

Unfortunately the Amber version of this batch still tastes like crap. I brewed it about 10 days later. For some odd reason I get lots of autolyzed yeast flavors. I'll taste again in a week and see if things have improved.

Adrian
03/29/11 03:51 PM  
Re: Revisiting T-58 Yeast
Amber one still tastes like crap. I think I screwed that one up some how. I may dump it.

That said, the cider turned out fine. A little more lemony than the WLP023 version I usually make and a little more cloudy. In fact, a lot more cloudy. It looks like hefeweizen.

The experimental 1 gallon of cider that had the 1lb of honey finished out at 0998. I'm estimating alcohol at ~10.5%. Wow! Surprisingly smooth for that strength. Oak is a little strong right now (1 ounce Hungarian cubes for 1 gal for about 1 month).

 
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